It feels like every time I try to get friends to have some fun in VR with me, the experience is somehow horribly painful. This time I kept a journal of the entire experience to catalogue the struggles seen by real Quest users every day.

The advent of Quest was supposed to streamline the usage of VR. But what was once friction of complicated hardware and requirements has been replaced with a mess of usability issues that make people not want to come back.

As much fun as I know it is to play VR with my friends, there’s a little part in the back of my mind that dreads it. I’m so used to telling my friends about some fun new VR game we can play together, only to have to drag them through a string of frustrating issues to finally reach the fun I had promised. It’s such a problem that I don’t ask my friends to play anything but the very best looking VR games with me, because the amount of struggle has to be offset by a great experience.

This week when I decided that the newly released Dungeons of Eternity looked good enough that I could convince my friends to give it a shot, that feeling of dread crept in again. I decided from the outset to keep journal of the experience because I knew there would be strife. There always is.

These Aren’t Novices

So let’s set the scene. I asked two of my good friends to play the game with me. Both are life-long hardcore gamers who own multiple consoles, have built their own PCs, and regularly seek out and play the latest non-VR games. Friend 1, let’s call him, has owned multiple PC VR headsets before getting Quest 2. On the other hand, Friend 2 got Quest 2 as their first VR headset.

Both have owned their Quest 2 for more than a year, but neither had used the headset in the last six months (after reading this journey you’ll understand why).

Imagine This, But Without Expert Guidance

And let’s be clear here. I’m a highly experienced VR user and know the Quest headsets and their software inside and out. I knew there would be struggles for them, so I anticipated and offered to walk them through the process of getting everything set up. With me there, they skipped any amount of googling for solutions to the issues they encountered. No normal VR user gets the benefit of an expert holding their hand through the process. This is to say: the experience that you read here is the absolute best case scenario—and it was still a struggle.

I knew since they hadn’t used their Quests recently that the headsets would need to get plugged in charged, updated, and controller batteries replaced. I told them both from the outset to make sure this happened before our planned play session (had they not realized they needed their headsets updated, it would have meant our planned play session would have begun with at least 15 minutes of updates, restarts, and game installs). In anticipation of stumbles along the way, I got Friend 1 into voice chat to make the process as seamless as possible. Here’s how that went.

Put on his headset to update. Controllers weren’t working and neither was hand tracking.

Fix: I walked him through the process of using the ‘cursor’ and ‘up volume’ button as a mouse click (an input modality most people in my experience don’t know exists on the headset). I had an inkling that hand-tracking might be disabled on his headset, so I told him to go to Settings and enable it.

Didn’t know where to find settings.

Fix: Told him to “click on the clock” then hit Settings at the top right. Mind you, the Settings ‘button’ at the top right does not have any visual indication that it is in fact, a button. It easily could be mistaken for the label of the panel.

Didn’t know where to find hand-tracking option.

Fix: He wandered through multiple sections of the Settings until finding it

With hand-tracking enabled, it was easier to guide him to the Software Update section of the Settings and have him hit the ‘check for update’ button.

Headset updated and restarted, but controllers still weren’t working.

Fix: I guided him through the process of holding two buttons on the controller to make the power LED flash. Had to tell him where to find the LED on the upper ring of the controller (it’s invisible when not active). Concluded that batteries weren’t charged, so he replaced them.

Now he needed to install the game. He had already purchased it online but couldn’t find it in his headset.

Fix: I told him to find the Store search and pull up the game and click the install button.

As we were going through this process, Friend 1 asked me about Dungeons of Eternity: “is the multiplayer pretty seamless?” I told him I didn’t know because I hadn’t tried multiplayer yet. Drawing upon his past experiences of VR he responded, “I’m guessing the answer is no.”

Installed and Ready to Play, Right?

So we got through the process required just to get the game installed and ready to play. But the issues didn’t end there, and not just for Friend 1 but also for me.

I had the foresight to start a party call in the headset with both friends so we could be in constant communication if when things went wrong. If I hadn’t done this we would have ended up separated, communicating by text or phone while in the headset trying to get all of the following solved, and that would have been far worse.

But when I first sent the party call invite to both friends, Friend 2 joined and I could hear him for a few moments, but then I got dropped out of the call. Friend 1 said he never got a notification to join the call in the first place.

Apple Confirms Vision Pro is Launching in China This Year, Going Where Meta Can't

Ok, so I hung up the call and tried again. This time Friend 2 got in and we didn’t get dropped out, but Friend 1 still got no notification about the call. So I walked him through how to find the headset’s notification section, from which he was able to join the party call.

Ok so we’re talking. Now how do I get my friends into the game with me? I opened the Quest menu and found my way to the party call where I was able to choose to bring the party to the game lobby. When I clicked the button to do so, both friends got a pop-up asking to travel to the game. “Awesome! Something is going to work!” I thought to myself.

Of course not. All three of us loaded into the game, but we weren’t connected together into a lobby. Ok, well at least we’re all in the game now, so let me try inviting them directly into the game instead of using the party travel system.

I opened the Quest menu, found the ‘invite’ button on the game panel, and when I clicked it, nothing appeared. I knew a list of friends should have appeared, but there was simply nothing. I backed out of the menu and tried again. Nothing appeared. This wasn’t even a blank page… just… air.

Attempting to invite my friends to the game. After the normal invite button was broken I searched for invite buttons elsewhere but didn’t find any | Note: While attempting to retrieve this video from my headset, the Gallery section of the Quest smartphone app bugged out and had to be force-quit before the video would appear.

At this point my friends were getting impatient just standing around in their uncomfortable headsets. So I tell them both to run through the tutorial separately, and we’d all meet up when that was done.

In the meantime, I tried going through the party call interface to pull up each friend’s Quest profile to see if I could invite them that way. This is very standard stuff for every other game platform… navigate to a friend’s profile and click an invite button. But I could only call or message them from there. I also went to the ‘People’ tab in the Quest menu to see if I could find them on my friends list and invite them that way. Nada.

Ok so I quit and relaunched the game. Upon trying the regular invite process again, the invite panel actually appeared!

Can We Play Yet?

They had finished their tutorials, so I sent them both an invite. And get this: it actually worked and they loaded into my lobby! Finally. Finally we’re going to play the game together.

If only.

I told them to drop out of our party chat so we could use in-game spatial audio. But they couldn’t hear me.

Eventually I saw an error pop up in the game, “attempt to login to voice chat timed out.”

Luckily I recalled that the first time I launched the game several days prior it had asked for permission to ‘record audio’. Since I had selected Solo Mode to play the game by myself, I didn’t initially understand why the game would want to ‘record audio’, so I reflexively denied the permission.

That meant when we tried to use in-game chat, it couldn’t connect me. Fixing this meant going into the headset’s system Settings to find App Permissions, then toggle the microphone permission for the specific game.

Now you might think ‘oh that’s just user error you obviously should have accepted the permission in the first place.’

And yet… no. This was a contextless permission request that goes against every modern guideline. I had opened the game to play it solo, not even thinking of its multiplayer component at the time. The permission was requested after I selected ‘Solo Play’. Why would a game want to ‘record audio’ in a single player mode?

Not only was this the wrong time to ask for the permission, the permission itself is unclear. ‘Record audio’ is very different than ‘transmit your voice for multiplayer chat’. Had the permission asked with that added context, I might have better understood what it was asking and why, even though it had asked at the wrong time.

Ok so the permission is sorted out. Then I had to restart the game. Of course that meant I also had to re-invite them to my lobby. I braced myself for disappointment when I clicked the button for the invite menu… alas, it actually appeared.

Found the Fun

After all of that—maybe 20 or 30 minutes of trying to get it all to work—we were finally standing next to each other in VR and also able to hear one another.

Perhaps the most frustrating part of all of this is how much it masks the magic of VR.

Within minutes, maybe even less then one minute, from launching into a mission together we were laughing together and having an absolute blast just screwing around in the very first room of the very first tutorial mission. Multiplayer VR is magical like that, especially with good friends. But it can be so painful to get there.

Meta is Pulling the Plug on Quest 1 Security Patches Next Month

And here’s the kicker. Even though we had a really fun time together, the repeated pain of finally getting to the fun burns into the subconscious like a scar that doesn’t go away. It had been more than six months since I was able to convince them to play a VR game together. The next time I ask them to play with me again, I won’t be surprised if they say ‘nah let’s play a flat game’.

– – — – –

And last but not least, it’s important to point out here that I’m not just ripping on Quest. I’m not saying other VR platforms do social better. I’m saying Quest doesn’t do it well enough.

Am I alone in this or have you had your own nightmares trying to play VR with friends? Drop a line in the comments below.

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Ben is the world's most senior professional analyst solely dedicated to the XR industry, having founded Road to VR in 2011—a year before the Oculus Kickstarter sparked a resurgence that led to the modern XR landscape. He has authored more than 3,000 articles chronicling the evolution of the XR industry over more than a decade. With that unique perspective, Ben has been consistently recognized as one of the most influential voices in XR, giving keynotes and joining panel and podcast discussions at key industry events. He is a self-described "journalist and analyst, not evangelist."
  • asdpls

    valve software

  • implicator

    I’ve found that the room code system that a lot of VR games have, which are specifically made to bypass Meta/Steam services, are the easiest way to play with friends. Being able to type or tell my friends to type in a six digit code for Phasmophobia or a keyword for Walkabout is much handier than having to fish through external menus.

    • Arno van Wingerde

      But the fact that that system exists at all suggests the weakness in meta’s approach. Of course, my mic is switched off for a company which stance to privacy cannot even be called questionable anymore even by its marketing department – maleficent is the word that better describes it. But at least I know where to find that setting. The friends he has obviously did not have a clue about their VR sets.

  • ViRGiN

    > I asked two of my good friends to play the game with me. Both are life-long hardcore gamers who own multiple consoles, have built their own PCs, and regularly seek out and play the latest non-VR games. Friend 1, let’s call him, has owned multiple PC VR headsets before getting Quest 2. On the other hand, Friend 2 got Quest 2 as their first VR headset.

    Such “advanced” users and can’t handle the VR on their own? Sounds like they have more money than basic skills.

    • Ben Lang

      Blaming users for not being able to use a product well enough is a sure-fire strategy for going out of business.

      • ViRGiN

        Were they such savants with PCs instantly after purchase? Or did they take their time and accumulated knowledge what control panel in windows is?

        It’s far from perfect, but it’s constantly evolving. Half the issues here are already solved like updates. Quest even has a feature to periodically turn itself on and check for updates. Software evolves, and games are never finished today, so in theory updates should be a good thing? Just think how crazy people would get if Alyx just got an update on Steam.

        It’s up to developers how they implement multiplayer, and wheter they adhere to Meta guidelines. It gets even more complex if devs are planning to release on other platforms than Quest, as there is no direct communication between Meta and Steam for example.

        And last, connecting everything with everyone is kinda… the metaverse point? You know it’s not releasing tomorrow.

        The experience isn’t in any way better on PC, and there are many more things that go wrong all the time, even as simple as input/output audio device switching. Did it make PCVR go out of business?

        • Thud

          ViRGiN, I’m going out of my way AGAIN to Highlight an instance when you make a effort to make an informed, non-insulting contribution nto the discourse. Good comment. You’re obviously not stupid. Acting that way is just not worth your time (or ours). PLEASE, keep moving in this direction andn you’ll be much better received here.

        • kakek

          The quest 2 is a closed device, closer to a console than a PC.
          I tried using in-headset call yesterday, and it was messy. There was a point where one of us couldn’t hear the other for zero reason. After restarting hte call and one headset multiple times, it suddenly started working for no more reason.

          I don’t expect that kind of problem when I’m using a meta solution on a meta headset running a meta OS. All 3 years old.

          The article is right. Multiplayer is clunky as hell, and on a closed environement it shouldn’t be. This is NOT a PC. There is no question of varying hardware, drivers, or even software. It should be much more flawless.

          • ViRGiN

            Flawless? PCs has been a thing for few decades now and they are as far as flawless as possible.
            One could think after 40+ years we wouldn’t have basic issues like with audio devices switching.

            I personally haven’t experienced the issue you are describing. Again, there is lots to improve in all directions.

          • kakek

            Pc is a different paradigm. There is no “authority” to ensure a common standard. It has to constantly adapt to new hardwares. There’s not even a guaranteed common framewrok for devellopers to rely on.
            I insisted a lot on the fact that the quest 2 is a controlled environement, closer to consoles.
            And consoles are less clunky.

            Meta should have been able to offer a more robust, easier to use framework for devellopers.

            I would bet this is partly due to their obsession with quests being a social thing rather than a gaming device. Implying a lot of vatious confidentiallity / followers setting, rather than a more straightforward system just for playing with people.

          • Baldrickk

            The party launch option likely failed because the friends didn’t even try launching the game first, and didn’t play through the tutorial. Article even says that that locked them out of the multiplayer until they had done it

            After which it worked fine.

          • Ben Lang

            That’s probably correct—and should have been anticipated by the platform/developer to create a sensible error message informing the users of what happened (or better yet, it should have just worked as expecged).

            This is basic UX. You don’t just let a user’s action fail and give zero feedback.

          • JakeDunnegan

            Technically, you can use PCVR on the Quest 2.

            But, I agree on a straight Quest 2 to Quest 2 connection, multiplayer should be a LOT easier. I have two of them, and it’s been hard as hell just to play minigolf with two players in the house with two sets. Or Table Tennis, etc.

      • shadow9d9

        These people couldn’t be bothered to install a game and go through a tutorial on their own or look in options menus. It is no different than a pc that needa windows and graphic card updates.

        • Arno van Wingerde

          No, as commented before, the Quest is more a console than a PC and should have console-like user friendliness. OTOH, I would have expected that people who built their PCs should be at least somewhat more clever than these friends were. The connectivity is central to the Metaverse concept, so should be user friendly.

    • Zantetsu

      It’s like you didn’t even read the article. By the way I thought I blocked you because of your incessant stupid comments. Did you come back with a new “nearly the same” user name or something?

      • ViRGiN

        I don’t know who you are and i don’t care, looks like you have nothing of value to say.

        PS. I like your name. You sound like a discord moderator.

    • Tanix Tx3

      I got, they play, but no vr for months, so no routine.
      Just in case you missed that part.

  • Oli Norwell

    This was an excellent summary. I’ve had very similar experiences and was nodding along as I was reading(!). These days I guide people to Walkabout Mini Golf as that seems to have solid multiplayer that “just works” and I find people really enjoy being able to just “hang out and chat stress free” when it isn’t their turn. Anything else feels prone to glitches and has me holding my breath hoping things work like they should.

  • eadVrim

    I think playing local multiplayer with Quest 3 in Mixed Reality could be interesting.

    • polysix

      For about 10 minutes then you’ll literally never touch it again.

      MR is just a novelty, and the tech is nowhere near good enough yet!

      The ONLY compelling VR has been PCVR or stuff like GT7 on PSVR2… standalone VR just doesn’t hold the interest long enough cos it’s barely ‘VR’ and feels shallow and gimmicky, both graphically and game wise. No Q3 faster chip will change that.

      • eadVrim

        Have you tried playing with a friend in Mixed Reality in the same place? If yes what is your feedback

      • ViRGiN

        100% right, that’s why Gorilla Tag is the most played PCVR game for about a year already. Regularly peaks above 1000+ concurrent players, dozens times more than games released in the past few years combined. It surpassed the previous PCVR hit, Beat Saber.

        PCVR is truly fascinating!

        • kakek

          You keep bringing what attract players as an argument. “Look how little people played vertigo 2 … look how gorilla tag is the most popular PCVR title …”

          I don’t care what is liked by the biggest number of people. If that was relevant, we would all drop VR altogether because flat gaming is hugely more popular.

          We all know there’s a lot of other factors than quality to explain something’s success ( or lack of.)

          There’s very few quality PCVR titles. And yet, if I make list of my best experience in VR, more than half of it is still PCVR titles. Despite a vastly bigger target audience and production, mobile VR struggle to offer me much games that really deliver what I expect from VR.

          That is single player campaign with stories and immersive environement to explore.

          The reasons are obvious. PCVR lack the market size to make such games profitable, considering they require a lot of content.
          But mobile VR lack the raw power to compute the level of details “immersive environement” require.

          Those day, I’m not satisfied by either plateform.

          • Arno van Wingerde

            But ViRGiN’s very strong argument remains: “look even if people make a much nicer looking PCVR version, it still does not get played very often”. I am puzzled by the fact that even the good PCVR games get fairly low stats. Perhaps people play the rather intense VR games for shorter periods than 2D games?

  • polysix

    No standalone game is even worth the slightest hassle… PCVR may be more convoluted (until you have it tweaked.. ie wireless on my Quest Pro) but at least once in it was WORTH the hassle cos it actually looks and feels like a ‘virtual reality’.

    Honestly, not one standalone game has ever made me feel VR is amazing, only a novelty, and as someone who’s been into VR since DK2 and had 7HMDS (inc quest 2 and PSVR1/2), standalone takes me back beyond even DK2 demo days. Something about that underpowered mobile chip VR is REALLY unimpressive, lacking in anything like the holy ‘presence’ we used to seek… so yeah it’s (supposedly) lower friction but, hardly worth it (low retention).

    PCVR is still the best esp now we have awesome wireless PCVR thanks to Quest Pro (built in and ergonomic with self tracked everything), standalone will always be a novelty/gimmick no matter how fast the chips get (only thing to sort that will be cloud streaming but… I’d still take PCVR)

    • ViRGiN


    • DoomDalek

      “Honestly, not one standalone game has ever made me feel VR is amazing, only a novelty, and as someone who’s been into VR since DK2 and had 7HMDS”

      I’ve been the VR space since DK2 also, and can suggest you try Red Matter 2 on Quest 3 and report back. Its a phenomenal experience for a standalone headset and ranks among the best VR games out there for ANY platform.

      • kakek

        I mostly agree with him.

        And while there’s a few exceptions ( red matter 2 being one ) it’s obvious delivering good environement on mobile hardware is a hassle. It requires miracles of optimisations.
        And even then, you still need to ALSO carefully design the whole game around the limitations of the hardware that still won’t let you achieve the level of fetails of red matter 2 for more than a few rooms at a time, or with more than 2/3 moving entities in it.

  • G’Zilla

    So yeah…it can be a pain in many games…thats why i play Walkabout golf.

  • As a dev, let me give you a bit of context on the Android permission you was asked. We have no control on what is written in those windows. Types of the permissions have also very specific names. We also found them a huge nuisance, so the least effort we can put in implementing them, the better :P

    The best approach in this case would probably have been to show a game popup saying “hey, now the operating system is going to ask you this and you have to say yes because we use it for that”, and after that, triggering the request of the permission. But no one got time fo dat.

    I have also to add that in some cases, if it is not the dev asking for it, it is unity that adds the request automatically

    • Guest

      The game engines add a whole extra layer of needless complexity. Why do you even use them?

    • Zantetsu

      > But no one got time fo dat.

      As a software developer, I will say that good developers have time for that.

      Software development is – or should be – all about making software that works as it should, not accepting compromises foisted by convenience layers. Find ways to smash through the convenience layers to get the correct functionality for your users.

      • ViRGiN

        Would love to see your uncompromised portfolio.

      • Octogod

        Can you share a link to your published store work? I love polished experiences.

        • Zantetsu

          I’ve never developed a VR game but I’ve developed lots of other software.

    • Tanix Tx3

      ‘But no one got time fo dat.’

      What you saying here is, devs have no time to do right, what they get paid for? Who forces you, to do what instead?
      IMO this could happen mostly to unexperienced devs, since the ‘fix’ is always the same routine, once the problem is known?

    • Octogod

      To add to this: in an ideal world the app could add the context for these permissions, but this would need to occur within the Store content so they can’t be modified on the fly.

    • Nostrildumbass

      The best approach in this case would probably have been to show a game popup

      Wouldn’t the permissions request come up before this even has a chance to be displayed?

    • Ad

      Obviously it should have a pop up.

  • Common sense

    Your experience and the problems you have encountered are not… I repeat, Not normal. You had more roadblocks that I have never, nor my many friends have ever had with the headsets. Your advice to these friends of yours should be common knowledge. Charging and updating are standard for all personal devices like headsets and phones. This article comes off as a complaint fest and if you let a battery powered device sit for months you can almost guarantee there will be issues. Incompetence aside I’m glad yall had fun.

    • Christian Schildwaechter

      The idea that knowing about workarounds to enable hand tracking, going through the store to launch a game one cannot find on the headset, or resolving issues with voice chat or game invites should be common knowledge, is nonsense. That’s like PC gamers suggesting all console gamers should switch to more powerful PCs, ignoring that the main benefit of consoles is playing games without having to deal with weird configurations, glitchy driver updates, or requiring special trouble shooting skills. And then complaining that all the AAA games they get are badly optimized ports from consoles not even utilizing their powerful hardware, simply because consoles sell a lot more.

      The question isn’t whether Ben’s experience was typical, or his friends should have been able to anticipate and/or solve them. The question is how often esp. new users will run into issues that would require skills to solve they don’t have. And how much of that is the fault of an inconsistent UI and system parts not working as they are supposed to. Quest had ~6.4mn active users in late 2022, so based on ~17mn HMDs sold by then, 10.4mn or more than 60% no longer bothered to use their headset at least once a month. It is unlikely that all of them couldn’t find a single game that still triggered their interest. It is much more likely that in the end, the benefits of VR just weren’t worth all the trouble anymore, from freeing up space to dealing with an uncomfortable and sweaty device that blinds you, to the many annoyances that Meta causes with their clunky UI and a library organization that only seems to get worse. Even if you and your friends never had any issues with the Quest, the huge number of people dropping out indicates that a lot of other users did.

      Anyone hoping for the active Quest user base to ever grow to numbers where AAA studios would even consider developing for it, should probably change their attitude from “get good” to pushing Meta to do everything they can, so that the few users that even bought the headset aren’t quickly driven away by a cascade of UI and system inconsistencies that make the experience unnecessarily complicated and annoying. Serving the VR enthusiasts alone won’t do the trick, the Quest has to also work for a lot of regular users that would probably rather switch back to their PS5 than having to deal with half-baked multiplayer setups, or even just having to recreate their guardian all the time, when all they want to do is play a game.

      • Zantetsu

        Good points, but I’ve noticed that you write incredibly long walls to make your point. You should focus on condensing your posts down to your main points. I doubt that many people do more than skim your comments. Honestly just trying to be helpful.

        Thanks for the upvote. I hope you realize I’m not trying to be harsh. I tend to write walls myself, but my friend you outdo me :)

        • Christian Schildwaechter

          The strange thing is that I agree. Keeping it short is always the plan, which regularly fails. The comment above is actually a shortened version. I could provide some background why this regularly happens (not only in comments), but it would end up in another wall of text. So my main point: you are right.

        • JakeDunnegan

          Have to agree. I write some long posts as well, but I have noticed that the longer the post, the fewer people will read it.

          It’s why snazzy one liners get like 8000 likes.

          • Arno van Wingerde

            Hm… just count the amount of likes Christian gets and you can see that this does not seem to apply within this (specialised) forum…

      • Ben Lang
      • Baldrickk

        Those “workarounds” wouldn’t have been needed if they had prepared…

        Dead batteries because they hadn’t been replaced.
        Game not appearing on the device because it hadn’t been installed

        These are not problems. They’re the basic steps to using digital hardware.
        Power it. Install the software.

    • TalonOne

      No this is absolutely my experience with VR & family since, Quest1 dropped. The only programs that ACTUALLY work well are things that don’t rely on Meta, like RecRoom and Walkabout MiniGolf. If it uses Meta then it’s a mess. Not only that, but every 2 months the UI COMPLETELY changes, causing you to once again not know where the heck stuff is! John Carmack must have been going insane with how stupid all this is. I bet it’s why he left.

  • Yeshaya

    An old HS friend has a Q2, and I figure playing Walkabout while chatting every couple months is a better way to keep in touch rather than a regular phone call or texts. And this seems like our usual script:
    “OK let’s go. Installing system updates? OK let’s check back in ten minutes. OK now launch Walkabout. OK I’m in the room, can you see me?No? What version of the game are you on? OK it needs an update too, OK lets give it a few more minutes. OK sure, we can try again tomorrow”

    • J.C.

      How is your friend’s headset not staying up to date? Mine check for updates pretty regularly. You leave it plugged in, and it’ll find the updates on its own. If your friend is shutting it completely off, and then not turning it on until the moment you’re about to play, whose fault is that?

  • Andrew

    You are so on point with this article! This is my exact experience when I try to get non VR gamer friends to play. They already aren’t in love with the idea of putting a screen on their face to start with, so any additional friction (we call it “tech support”) really drags the experience down. I think your point is that these issues hinder the wider adoption of VR even within the most obvious demographic of gamers.

    • Jonathan Winters III

      True. Meta has made a lot of progress removing friction (remember the Rift CV1 days – with sensors and setup woes?), so fingers crossed they’ll iron out more issues as long as people REPORT them to Meta.

  • Mic Ty

    since they already have gone through the process, isnt it worth trying again, and hopefully this time, it’s smoother?

  • Tanix Tx3

    And now imagine you have a mixed group aka crossplay. This may avoid somth like your permission problem, but since nobody knows what kind of obstacle is lurking at the friends system, everybody is on his own to get the vr running.
    And you dont even have a party call, just the struggle to switch between headset and extra messenger on smartphone, this sucks hard.
    No way to do this with newbies, it will drive eperbody crazy!

  • impurekind

    Setting up Quest headsets in general isn’t even streamlined. I had to factory reset my Quest 2 yesterday, and the amount of hoops you have to jump through literally just to get into the headset and use the thing is a f’n joke. It should be as simple as pressing the power button, waiting for a few seconds as the system boots up, and then your in, with a few built in and genuinely essential apps and nothing more (Settings, Store so you can get anything else you want, a few free games/demos so there’s something to play out the box, at that’s about all)–that’s it. Everything else after that should basically be optional, including all the crappy “social” media accounts and the like. Right now, getting into Quest 2 is a totally convoluted mess, and that’s terrible for VR if we ever truly expect it to go mainstream–it’s simply not ready for that.

  • Ron Doyle

    I get it, this happens to me the first few times as well until I train the folks. There will always be a learning curve regardless. If you took a non gamer, non techy and had him turn his xbox or playstation on, it would be the same thing man. I’m a tech genious and gamer my whole life, and had issues with Sony changing from game chat to party chat the other day. Never did it, went entire match of firewall in party chat when my party joined game chat. I agree some things need to change, record audio is stupidest wording ever, it threw me a few times, always throws my uncle every time LMAO.

  • Isaac

    This is one of the biggest barriers to VR retention and among the easier ones to solve. Appreciate your continuous efforts in cataloguing and bringing attention to this. I am sure people at Meta must be aware of this, but it would be great if you tag the active ones in your social media posts.

  • Kenny

    Could not agree more. It’s pretty terrible. For a company that is all about “social,” friction (bordering on fire) related to playing together with friends is quite the ball drop.

  • afox381

    A great article. This sums up all of my experiences to date with Quest and PC VR.

    As a developer in the Apple ecosystem, the only solution I see is the OS/platform owners (Google, Apple, Microsoft, and nominally Nintendo) taking over. Sony are a great example. I’ve heard great things about how seamless and slick the PSVR2 experience is, but then of course it is. They control the hardware and software end-to-end to make it so. I suspect Apple’s Vision Pro will be the same next year, and they have a history of things “just working” which bodes well. Having had the benefit of developing for the Vision Pro for the last few months, I can say that the API and overall experience are both incredibly slick (as I’ve come to expect) and suspect the headset will transform people’s expectations if not VR as a whole.

    Whilst I’m pretty cool on Meta generally (I just don’t think they’re in a position to create the perfect end-to-end experience), having Sony pitching in and Apple showing how it can be done is a real blessing for the industry, and if Microsoft and Google start integrating VR at the OS level we may start to see some big changes happen really quickly. I’ve loved what I’ve experienced so far in the VR space, but things are just starting to hot up. I suspect this next year is going to upend everything.

    • XRC

      Google’s Daydream platform showed their UX and software chops no doubt.

      • Guest

        Daydream UX was a nightmare!

        • XRC

          Not in my experience as daydream user (original and 2017 versions). Very slick UX and excellent integration of Google photos, YouTube, etc.

  • Alex

    I understand the situation of this article. What I understand is that your 2 friends are obviously noobs and clearly don’t want to play VR if they don’t use their headset for 6 months. Just tell them to sell the damn thing and find other friends to play VR.

    Hell even my friend (who’s not a hardcore gamer nor a tech genius) need not to be reminded to charge and update both software and game app. It’s just common sense. We play once every 2 weeks and never had any problem.

  • shadow9d9

    So, you had friends that didn’t jnow even basic functionality like updating..and couldn’t be bothered to get to know their headsets enough to have gone throigh option menus..didn’t even know how to install games or go through tutorials yet? That part(the bulk of your issues) is all on them.

    • Ben Lang

      Copy-paste from another reply:

      Blaming users for not being able to use a product well enough is a sure-fire strategy for going out of business.

      • ViRGiN

        Blaming companies for following standard practices from the past 15 years is not the way to go. Users needs to adapt. And it’s crystal clear your friends have spent at least 5000 hours on PC alone. I’m sure their first 10 hours were absolutetly horrible and could only type on keyboard with index finger.

        You want plug and play experience, get an offline only console with physical media games. SNES should be perfect – no online multiplayer, no updates, no loading times – just insert cartridge and play.

        How these super advanced users get around downloading daily steam updates and stuff?

        • Walter

          Have to disagree here. The Quest is supposed to bring the masses to VR – and Standalone is supposed to be “plug-and-play” so your “expert” analogy doesn’t apply here.

          • ViRGiN

            I can guarantee you even iPhones aren’t simple enough for tons of people.

          • shadow9d9

            It literally has the pictures and names of the games and all you need to do to install is click on it once. It couldn’t be any easier at this point. This is just people who couldn’t be bothered to do the bare minimum.

            Steam, with 20 years of UI improvements, has a more complex process. I guess PC is impenetrable then.. Because, gasp, they’d have to click on their library tag and actually search for a game, double click, choose directory, find the icon on their desktop. Playing the tutorial would still be EXACTLY THE SAME ON ANY SYSTEM!

          • Jonathan Winters III

            Yes but that said, Meta really does need to make it foolproof in order to accellerate mass adoption.

          • Baldrickk

            Hard to make it obvious to the point that someone who can’t figure out that “battery operated device THAT MY FRIEND TOLD ME NEEDED BATTERIES REPLACED isn’t working, just might have dead batteries in it

          • Arno van Wingerde

            Nobody was claiming that Steam is perfect… but if I compare my iPhone’s Permissions system and get notifications that this app needs acces to microphone/contacts/GPS/… , because … then I feel that Apple has streamlined the process beter than Meta.

        • Ben Lang

          User’s don’t need to do anything. They either see value in a product and buy/use it, or they don’t. If you are a company that makes said product, it’s up to you to help them see the value. Otherwise you lose customers and eventually go out of business. You’re never going to convince users to ‘just try harder to enjoy our product’.

          • ViRGiN

            Absolutetly wrong, it’s not an ipod to just choose a song and it plays on it’s own.
            Then again, you come out of the side of “high end” meaning $800+, so all your opinions are basically irrelevant.

            This whole post says more about your friends than it does about Quest.

      • shadow9d9

        Umm, you can lead a horse to water. We are talking about bottom of the barrel amount of effort put in. Come on.. not updating a system or keeping it charged? Not knowing how to install games when all you have to do is go to the icon with the game’s picture on it to install it.. not knowing to do a tutorial first? These have NOTHING to do with a gaming unit manufacturer. It is like blaming a stove manufacturer because the consumer doesn’t plug it in.

        And the fact that you read my post and THAT was your response shows a completely disingenuous bent and an unwillingness to admit that this has nothing to do with the quest and has everything to do with friends who can’t be bothered to do the absolute bare minimum.

        • Christian Schildwaechter

          YOU are “talking about bottom of the barrel amount of effort put in”, because you only focus on those of the problems listed that could have been prevented by planing ahead, and deliberately ignore those where the system simply failed.

          Given that most of the now 80+ comments in this thread agree with the article, confirm the many problems with Meta’s multiplayer implementation and issues caused by Meta repeatedly changing the Quest UI, plus the fact that you are pretty much the only one who systematically downvoted those blaming mostly Meta instead of the users, the “unwillingness to admit that this has a lot to do with the Quest” is placed safely in your corner.

          Even if you were extremely lucky and never had any of the issues, you should at least acknowledge that others might have, and not blindly insist that all the problems must be due to lack of trying and user errors. This is not a conspiracy by VR users trying to distract from their incompetence by blame-shifting it onto Meta. This is people actually trying, and technology (not always, but too often) failing.

          • shadow9d9

            Some of the problems? 2/3 of the “issues” encountered. Not charging an electronic device before use? Not knowing how to do a single click to install? Not knowing that games need to have you run through a tutorial first? Issue after issue here is fake. Why were they even INCLUDED in the “article”? They are completely irrelevant. Their sole purpose was try to jump enough nonsense together to create an argument out of thin air. The only relevant pieces would be voice and getting into the game.

            And you are seeing what you want to see in the responses.

          • Christian Schildwaechter

            So you agree that the Quest has some serious issues regarding multiplayer and voice chat that can be game breaking even for experienced users, and your only real complaint is that the article doesn’t solely focus on those issues that Meta has to fix urgently, in order not to drive customers away?

          • Arno van Wingerde

            Well mentioning discharged batteries and such which is really 101 in using electronics distracts from the real issues.

      • J.C.

        Ok, that’s only *sort of* a fair point. The first third of the “slew of problems” could have been avoided if your friend was even mildly capable as a human being. Why would he need to learn how to use the hidden mouse-click and hand tracking if he had listened AT ALL to you and replaced the controller batteries? And if he DID replace them, did he bother to see if those batteries (rechargeables lose charge when they sit unused, this is common knowledge) were even charged? That had absolutely nothing to do with the device itself.
        If you’re going to bother telling me your friends aren’t novice idiots, maybe don’t then spend several paragraphs proving that they are, in fact, idiots.

        • Ben Lang

          ‘The users must be too dumb to use the product’ is never the right answer.

          Even if they could figure it out, what about your Mom or Dad? My parents would never in a million years have the knowledge or patience to fix these issues. But why shouldn’t they get to use VR if it’s so great? Both of them use a smartphone just fine.

          • Terendir

            That is a typical American approach. Like “carful, knife is sharp”.

            Dont get me wrong. There are a lot of things than can get done way better on the quest. I am still wondering for a year, why some absolute state of art elements havent been introduced yet. But many issues this article is pointing out… sorry, the users are to blame for.

            Some things like updating, learning to use the system, how to interact with the UI etc, especially if they are owning the system for months is a no brainer. As I purchased the Quest 2, and this was my first VR-headset ever, I had NEVER had such problems with it. Not even closely. So I am either doubting these friends are really that good with technic or they never had any ambition to even use the headset and wanted to make this experience an ordeal, so that may never again need to put in on again.

          • J.C.

            Ok at what point DO you blame the user, though? Not even checking if the batteries are charged/good seems like a pretty obvious thing. Do your parents give up and stop using their tv because the remote stops working? No, I bet they have the wherewithal to try the batteries before resorting to far more difficult maneuvers with the buttons on the tv itself.

            Some of the issues you ran into are real! The controller battery/using the hidden mouseclick is not. If you can’t figure out a dead battery you need to stop using electronics and go build a barn with the Amish.

          • trmn8r

            Not knowing how to update things is a Console/PC issue to. Don’t inflate basic procedures that all gamers on any format have to go through… How the heck is that Meta’s problem if your friends aren’t smart enough to know that wireless things use batteries?

          • Arno van Wingerde

            I agree with J.C. Anybody not living on a remote island knows that electronics needs to be charged. My 90 year old mother has no problems with that. For friends who “are life-long hardcore gamers who own multiple consoles, have built their own PCs, and regularly seek out and play the latest non-VR games” this seems somewhat improbable and distracts from the very real issues mentioned further in the article.

      • dimzy

        But you told them to download the game and make sure they had fresh batteries in their controllers and an uninstalled game and dead batteries were two of the first issues you had to tackle…

    • ribbitz

      What Ben said, but also if the reality is that most people screw this up, then design principles need to be more reality-based, because at the end of the day I want to play a game, instead of sitting around yelling at all of my friends and family every time. It’s definitely possible to make this work better, and that’s much easier than training every person on the earth to troubleshoot obstinate equipment.

    • Marc Delpont

      Quest is supposed to be an end-user product, not a professional hardware. One doesn’t need to be an engineer to use a microwave oven or a coffee machine…

  • Foreign Devil

    Meta should hire you OP to advise and test their UI and make it streamlined, intuitive and bug free.

    • shadow9d9

      Hire someone that blames meta for friends that don’t charge or update their headset, or know how to click a button to install or to play a tutorial first? What kind of braindead people are these friends? They wouldn’t be able to figure out how to install a game on steam for sure, let alone launch it.. nor would they be able to navigate the menus on even consoles to install anything…

      • Ben Lang

        The reality is that lots of people put down their headset and don’t come back for months at a time. If every time they do come back they have a bad experience—causing them to not want to come back for several month months—that’s a problem and Meta needs to take measures to address.

        I once again quote from another response: “Blaming users for not being able to use a product well enough is a sure-fire strategy for going out of business.”

  • Octogod

    I wish Meta would stop modifying the menus/OS and focus on making things “just work”.

    Its sobbering how many times I had to find an obscure forum to figure out how to do something basic while setting up the Quest 3.

  • Nothing to see here

    VR at its best is a solitary experience. The technology practically screams “escape from reality to a world all your own” at the top of its lungs. This is why Meta, a company founded as a social network, getting into VR never made a lot of sense. They can keep trying to force people who want to be alone to interact with each other (looking at you Horizon) but that works as well as forcing all the introverted kids to dance with each other at a ball for loners. At best its a failure. At worst it’s creepy as hell.

    • Andrew Jakobs

      Uhm, co-op in VR each at their own location is fun as hell, it’s actually much more social then doing it through a flatscreen.

      • JakeDunnegan

        Agreed. When you think of Facebook connecting people (friends and family) from distant places, getting into VR early actually seems like a pretty savvy move. (If it actually evolves into what we hope it can.)

        Though, the idea of the metaverse actually “replacing” reality in any real sense still seems like the stuff of strange science fiction.

        • Arno van Wingerde

          Yeah, so was the internet half a century ago…

    • Guest

      So true. Multiuser VR is an oxymoron!

  • mz8i

    Agreed re Quest UX – but on the scale of half-bakedness, nothing beats Magic Leap One… :) I once tried to use it at a hackathon for WebXR with hand tracking. I disconnected the controllers and then had to restart the device for some reason. Only to realise that there was a passcode screen after reboot that didn’t support hand tracking, meanwhile the controllers were disconnected. So the device was stuck on a login screen with absolutely no way of getting out of it. Had to factory reset the device… After doing that, I put it back in the box where it came from :P

  • Clownworld14

    Relatable 100%, this is why I rarely fire up vr except if I’m doing a solo adventure or I really wanna see the latest game/update on something.
    Having said that, there are plenty of times wherein its a simple process and I get in the game immediately just fine.
    Everyone basically wants streamlined UI, it shouldn’t be too much to ask.

  • Christian Schildwaechter

    It’s a bizarre idea that the Quest is not to blame if users, when trying to start a multiplayer game by the methods that Meta provides for this, can’t do that, because the invite button doesn’t do anything. Is Meta off the hook every time someone buys a game without first researching whether it has implemented its own matchmaking, to work around the issues with Meta’s multiplayer functionality? So it is the user’s fault for trusting Meta’s software to function in the first place?

    And is it also never Meta’s responsibility if users try something as challenging as joining multiplayer games without first becoming experts in Quest setup and trouble shooting? How dare they to buy a new Quest and a new game and expect joining a party in a multiplayer game to actually just work. The audacity!

    • to be fair, as a non-Switch user until 2 years ago: initial setup for multiplayer games wasn’t just click-and-go either. I was slightly amazed.

    • shadow9d9

      But that isn’t what the majority of this article was was about people who didn’t charge their headsets, didn’t update them, didn’t know how to even install games, let alone do the tutorials.. you won’t be able to play multiplayer on The Nintendo Switch either if people don’t know how to update, install games, or play tutorials…

      • Christian Schildwaechter

        This is not about a majority decision. If there is a game breaking bug, the fact that most of the minor issues could easily be worked around doesn’t mean it is okay. Those annoyances just add on top.

        And I’ve run into enough situations where I just wanted to show a visitor something, only to first have to deal with charging or updates or resetting the guardian or getting the streaming via the phone app to work, so I could guide the person. Sure, a lot of that can be prevented by proper preparation, and sure, other platforms also have issues. But all this adds to the already cumbersome physically experience of having to wear a headset. It is death by a thousand cuts, clearly impacting the low retention rates among the less enthusiastic, and a lot of it would be preventable by Meta.

    • Baldrickk

      It’s not a quest issue if the game failed to bring up a menu.
      And after a restart, it did, so who knows what the problem was there, but it was simply resolved by the most basic troubleshooting step.

      If the game doesn’t allow players to join multiplayer until after the tutorial has been played, then it makes sense that the join as group function didn’t work, right? The article doesn’t say that they tried that again after completing the tutorial. So we can’t say that it doesn’t work.

      And if it doesn’t work, the game is the one at fault – not meta. As much as I don’t like the company, the “join as group” function is just a message being sent to the game through some API – that probably works just fine.

      • Christian Schildwaechter

        If it was one app or two, fine. But if you have a thread of now 110+ comments, most of which complain about the bad multiplayer experience in many apps, it is pretty safe to say that this is not just a problem of a few incompetent users or incompetent developers, but that the way Meta implemented it leads to those problems.

        Esp. since the exceptions listed are those like Walkabout Mini Golf that implement their own idiot-proof invite system, and thereby circumvent the API Meta provided for this. And an API that doesn’t work on the initial attempt, but without a recognizable reason then works after a reboot, is broken. Restarting may be a standard troubleshooting measure, but it is not part of the standard operation of a device, it is a workaround for something not working properly that should.

        It is of course impossible to make something completely idiot proof, but the Meta apologists in this thread are mostly hung up on the battery issue, concluding that this can’t be Meta’s fault, but then deliberately ignore the many other issues mentioned for which there was no obvious reason. Meta did a poor job in smoothing the path, while other companies manage to release APIs that allow multiplayer to work reliably for everyone.

        And even the battery issue can be mostly idiot-proofed by including a little LED hardware indicator on the controllers itself that with one press shows the charging level, instead of requiring a working connection to the HMD to get that information. Always keeping a battery tester with you Quest is again a troubleshooting measure, and not something that should be required.

      • Arno van Wingerde

        Meta should offer a unified approach to settings: Apple, a future competitor, shows how to do that. If games are left to come up with a system themselves, multiplayer will be different for each game and therefore harder to try.

  • ViRGiN

    So the PCVR experience isn’t better, obviously you are a SteamVR fanboy, and love it so much you don’t use any of it’s features, outsourcing everything everywhere else.

    Also bringing discord as an example, as if millions of manhours haven’t been wasted trying to get audio from the right mic, OBS to pick up, or discord itself having downtime more often recently than in the past years.

    • NL_VR


      • ViRGiN


        • NL_VR


          • ViRGiN

            I LIKE ALYX TOO

          • NL_VR


  • Ariel

    Most weeks, I play VR games with family members who live a thousand miles away, and most weeks we have some sort of problem. I hope Meta takes notice of this article and puts some muscle behind fixing their party system and working with devs, both to help them and to hold them accountable for multiplayer functionality (inside and outside of parties).

    This week my mom struggled setting up the guardian for ten minutes, and then later when my dad got into After the Fall and I added him to my team, I could hear my uncle but not him (presummably because my dad was in a different “lobby”). UI and multiplayer nightmares like this deter people from using any app in VR. I just want to share the joy of VR!

  • TalonOne

    This article needs to land on Zucks lap. I purchased headsets for me, both my kids and both my nephews… We NEVER play together because every time we try the interface has changed and I cannot help them from across the planet. I can’t see what they can see, and I can’t help them even find stuff that used to be the same but is now different because some meta tw@t decided to change the UI again. All the guides on Youtube are stale now too.

    And then there’s this idiotic followers/follow BS. Like, how can you confuse this more Meta? And finally, yeah, once you’re all seemingly set up something else doesn’t work. Look, I didn’t pay 2,000 dollars to d1ck around in the UI. Long story short, nobody wants to play VR. It’s just a giant PITA.

    • shadow9d9

      If people can’t install games or know enough to play tutorials first, then any console won’t work for them, and neither will steam. This is a garbage piece.

  • JanO

    A faster processor can’t help with bad software design…

    What Meta needs to do is rethink the whole UI/UX, but they seem more focussed on adding various features way before anything is actually logical and efficient.

  • You ever do something with people who aren’t enthusiastic, and suddenly they seem brick-dumb/braindead at every turn? “Where is the power button?”, “How do I click?”, “I can’t see when I close my eyelids, how do I see again?”.

    There’s nothing hard about any of this, *IF* they really wanted to do it and/or cared in the least. I introduced a friend to VR and now he won’t PLAY anything that isn’t in VR. VR is pretty awesome, at least if you’re into VR.

    “Not touched their headsets in 6 months”??? Yah, they hate VR. Man, I can’t go more then a night. None of these problems are real problems. You could say all of this about the Switch or Xbox. They haven’t found any VR games that convinced them to open their minds to that “new thing”, so they are obstinately trying to stay in the flat-world.

    Personally, after 8 months of VR, I found flat games sort of nauseating to use. again They don’t move with my head. I can only look in one direction (aka the monitor in front of me). I can’t aim around corners. All of my interactions are simple button pushes on a controller. It’s all so limiting.

    • Ben Lang

      Data suggests more than 50% of people who bought VR headsets don’t use them on a regular basis, so thinking that “none of these are real problems” because you and your friends like to play is just survivorship bias.

      People ‘hate VR’ because of experiences like the ones I described above, not because they just do. When someone buys a headset they have a belief that they’re going to use it and get value from it.

      • Arno van Wingerde

        Ben: do you know what those percentages look like for consoles?

    • Arno van Wingerde

      I very much agree with your assessment of VR versus 2D games. However, that is us: why are so many others buying & trying the thing for a bit, then putting it away? how come so many people try these things at our homes, say it is amazing, but never buy the thing? I am curious to see how Sony and Apple will do in this market. But for Sony: although the UI is nice (except for asking you to take off your VR glasses in order to look at the flat monitor!). The PSVR2 device is beautiful, but requires a lot of fiddling with cables, earplugs, sweet spot etc. not to mention the absolute cable mess at the original PSVR. Apple might corner the professional/enthusiast market, then come up with cheaper versions to open up the mass market…

  • Rustykaks

    I think what people are missing with the “they should have known how to update or this and that” is that UX should always be guiding through that process. Like , for instance, if it detects you controller batteries are dead it should just activate hand tracking by default. Or build a standardised multiplayer service that devs can just plug in to. Like. If they are in party mode and launch a game, it should then by default utilise spacial audio.

    I see people mentioning switch multiplayer setup as a comparison, but, the switch is a touch screen device aimed at kids , but, with a paid multiplayer service, the setup is used usually by a parent or an adult. Also most of the multiplayer experiences on the switch are without voice , for obvious reasons as a hugh % of users are kids.

    I think the issue here is no one in meta is in full control of the complete user experience. The ux team are trying to suit all types of people, that is advanced and novice. You can’t do that, especially with the level of variance in that knowledge.

    This is a new medium, a new way of interacting, so without proper guidance, on top of shakey implementation it is a recipe for disaster. Also, iterating on that shake foundation without addressing these core issues will never fix the problem. Meta need to build a new os. They need to look at the android model and work on interoperability of software and systems and ensure a framework is in play for developers to plug into , and if they don’t follow that framework, the application gets rejected.

  • Jonathan Winters III

    Welcome to the bleeding edge, Ben. It’s gonna be like that for a long while yet.

  • Dewey Bushaw

    This sounds like picnic problems. Anyone who has owned a Quest knows they roll out new updates often unlike major consoles that just stay buggy for long periods of time.

    Not having your headset charged and controllers having fresh batteries is a noob problem. It is a standalone device, do they often leave their house with their phones dead!?! I doubt it.

    I play many VR games with a wide variety of friends both IRL and ones I met along the way. I run an esport league for Hyper Dash where everyone has to coordinate to get into the game and I have not experienced the struggles you out line.

    DoE doesn’t use hand tracking and controllers are easier to use to navigate the meta system UI. Settings is also accessible from the apps page and is a much easier way to get to it then the quick settings which is there for those who are more familiar with the device. Launching from a party chat can sometimes fail but you can always just go into the game and host a room for people to join. You don’t have to rely on the meta’s quick launch features. In fact most the hardcore gamers don’t.

    Articles like yours make it seem like this system is too difficult and add that you are a seasoned VR player but from what I can tell that doesn’t track. And being a hard core gamer doesn’t mean squat if the people don’t take time to learn the system they are interfacing with enough to know where the settings are. That’s just basic 101 that they failed to do on their own when they got their device.

  • Richard R Garabedian

    its always the same…the same buddy system that lets you talk to your friends…actually hinders your games separate buddy system

  • Ron Doyle

    repasting my reply because it really needs to be read and understood by noobs and complainers :)

    I get it, this happens to me the first few times as well until I train the folks. There will always be a learning curve regardless. If you took a non gamer, non techy and had him turn a xbox or playstation on, it would be the same thing man. I’m a tech genious and gamer my whole life, and had issues with Sony changing from game chat to party chat the other day. Never did it, went entire match of firewall in party chat when my party joined game chat. I started to get angry because I couldn’t figure it out and could hear others saying what is Ron Doing does he know how to change :) I agree some things need to change, record audio is stupidest wording ever, it threw me a few times, always throws my uncle every time LMAO.

    You have to train them properly and make sure they understand things so it gets better next time. Like ALWAYS press accept if record audio pops up, ALWAYS!! This on you, train them correctly and good the first few times lol

    Ah I missed these people were life long gamers and techies. That’s kind of hard to believe, but yes, every tech has its own learning curve. If we want no learning curve and to work for masses, it has long way to go. These techies I’m sure had issues with their phones for months when smart phones were introduced, but now they understand the phones and the system and have no anxiety or learning curve. Its just no one wants to learn, everyone wants to complain. LOL.

    • CrusaderCaracal


    • Arno van Wingerde

      You are right to a point, but the argument of many people here is that Meta makes it (much) more difficult than it needs to be, due to a poor UI.

  • trmn8r

    Yeah so that whole “These Aren’t Novices” thing is BS. Your friends are most definitely novices. They clearly haven’t played their VR headsets if their struggles are that basic…

    • Ben Lang

      So, to use a VR headset without issues, you need to have first spend a lot of time using a VR headset?

      Do you see how this is a problem from the standpoint of trying to get market traction with a new product?

      • ViRGiN

        Can I buy a Windows PC or a Mac for my 80+ year old grandma and she will “just get it”?
        She uses her Nokia phone flawlessly.

        • Arno van Wingerde

          We give my mom, also 80+ at the time (90 now) an iPad and by and large it works just fine.

  • gruguir

    The current state of the operating system is catastrophic in my opinion, with everlasting bugs and nonsensical UX design.
    Now I’ll have to deal with comments from users in denial who think it’s okay to work around bugs for hours, but blaming other users isn’t going to fix the software.

  • Yeshaya

    Using this a cautionary tale. My friend wants to go to a VR arcade to play a very similar looking dungeon crawler game, where I’d much rather play this DoE together in our respective homes, him using my old Quest 2. Wondering how much of this nightmare I’ll be able to dodge by making sure the headset is all up to date at my house. He’ll need to handle the environment setup, game start, and party joining himself though. I hate that I’m considering buying $100 tickets and driving an hour just to avoid the clunkiness of VR setup